Rossi to Yamaha!!

[Squidpuppet]

In which case it will be Rossi they pull back, hence his (official or unofficial) # 2 status.

That assumes that both are in the points chase.

That is my point. In ANY scenario where Yamaha is FORCED to choose between the two, it will be Jorge. Be it round 15 with 7 points between them, or round 16 with 3 points, or 10, doesnt matter, they will choose Jorge because he represents the future and they cant afford to lose him.

[ieism]

I'm a Rossi fan, but this made me laugh a little :

"Rossi, who is presently 8th in the Championship standings, will partner Jorge Lorenzo who currently leads the 2012 MotoGP World Championship by 23 points, having taken five victories from the first ten completed races of the 18 race series."

So funny how they emphasized that, not sure if it's a stab at Rossi, Ducati, or both though.. But it seems they are making it very clear who their number one rider is from the whole press release. It's going to be an interesting season for sure.

[Faster1]

#1 ,,,, #2

,,there are few things more certain than Rossi never "not" trying to win every race , every time, regardless of any "team orders" or,, to hold back, even at the last race of the year and Lorenzo is one position away from the championship and VR is in front of him.. pa-lease... After Motegi he all but scoffed at being warned about dicing it up with Lorenzo.
No, race fans, In VR's mind he is/will always be the #1 rider and you can't blame him. But next year, in a clean race, on paper, Lorenzo would probably win the majority of races but there still are a few tracks where Rossi legitimately smoke the field. And "clean" is the operative word. I am not implying the VR is "dirty", but there is a difference between courteous racing and,, errr,, Sete Jibernau's left wrist. Also, you can't say superior race-craft without saying "anything goes". Jog all your memories about VR and Stoner at Laguna a few years back,,, Superior "race-craft" triumphed over superior speed it was genius at work, all legit. But now it's his team-mate and in the end, what Rossi wants , Rossi gets. The problem is that neither Lorenzo nor Rossi will accept simply being slower than the other. The rider of that "short straw" will no doubt place a certain degree of blame on the other. You might as well dust off the previously stored garage dividers. My ultimate prediction is that "Yamaha's" greed will be what brings down the blue empire.

I have another possible scenario : lets say that during the development of the 2013 bike, Lorenzo loves it and Rossi hates it... Does VR/JB steer that ship only to alienate Lorenzo,,, Or does JL/RF say what stays and goes??? Both have distinctly different riding styles and preferences. Two alpha males fighting over one design direction .

Those fans that like a little drama circus thrown in with their racing are loving this for sure. As a fan of both riders, I just want the fastest rider to win and I'm already resigned to the fact that I won't get what I want. Cynical? yes but also somewhat objective and realistic. I have no illusion of this ended well for anyone at Yamaha. Advantage? Honda.

The great "Blue train-wreck" ,, could be I'll be adding a new prediction signature,,, Albert?

[coyote]

Yes, that bit...........

There is no reason for Yamaha to restrain either one of them, unless there is a points battle with someone else at the end of the season.

In which case it will be Rossi they pull back, hence his (official or unofficial) # 2 status.

Jorge is there for the title. Rossi is there for marketing. Yamaha said as much back in 2010 when they cut Rossis salary and gave it to Jorge.

There will be a monumental amount of ego in play, both on and off the track.

That doesn't make any sense. They will pull back the guy with no chance for the title if the guy in front needs it to win the title.

That is my point. In ANY scenario where Yamaha is FORCED to choose between the two, it will be Jorge. Be it round 15 with 7 points between them, or round 16 with 3 points, or 10, doesnt matter, they will choose Jorge because he represents the future and they cant afford to lose him.

How many rounds are there? Anyway, no they won't.

[Cam D]

#1 ,,,, #2

,,there are few things more certain than Rossi never "not" trying to win every race , every time, regardless of any "team orders" or,, to hold back, even at the last race of the year and Lorenzo is one position away from the championship and VR is in front of him.. pa-lease... After Motegi he all but scoffed at being warned about dicing it up with Lorenzo.
No, race fans, In VR's mind he is/will always be the #1 rider and you can't blame him. But next year, in a clean race, on paper, Lorenzo would probably win the majority of races but there still are a few tracks where Rossi legitimately smoke the field. And "clean" is the operative word. I am not implying the VR is "dirty", but there is a difference between courteous racing and,, errr,, Sete Jibernau's left wrist. Also, you can't say superior race-craft without saying "anything goes". Jog all your memories about VR and Stoner at Laguna a few years back,,, Superior "race-craft" triumphed over superior speed it was genius at work, all legit. But now it's his team-mate and in the end, what Rossi wants , Rossi gets. The problem is that neither Lorenzo nor Rossi will accept simply being slower than the other. The rider of that "short straw" will no doubt place a certain degree of blame on the other. You might as well dust off the previously stored garage dividers. My ultimate prediction is that "Yamaha's" greed will be what brings down the blue empire.

I have another possible scenario : lets say that during the development of the 2013 bike, Lorenzo loves it and Rossi hates it... Does VR/JB steer that ship only to alienate Lorenzo,,, Or does JL/RF say what stays and goes??? Both have distinctly different riding styles and preferences. Two alpha males fighting over one design direction .

Those fans that like a little drama circus thrown in with their racing are loving this for sure. As a fan of both riders, I just want the fastest rider to win and I'm already resigned to the fact that I won't get what I want. Cynical? yes but also somewhat objective and realistic. I have no illusion of this ended well for anyone at Yamaha. Advantage? Honda.

The great "Blue train-wreck" ,, could be I'll be adding a new prediction signature,,, Albert?

I have to agreed with those that think this is a poor decision (championship wise) by Yamaha, I don't think next year will be pretty. I think Jorge will have to shelve this gentlemens agreement about being nice on the track. Rossi has shown he doesn't have a problem with running someone wide to win, and if Jorge is in front of Rossi on the last lap I would put my money on Rossi to win. Yamaha have just painted a HUGE target on Jorge's leathers, his only hope is to be fast enough that he has a good gap. Not sure that that will happen too often.

[_M_]

...You might as well dust off the previously stored garage dividers. My ultimate prediction is that "Yamaha's" greed will be what brings down the blue empire...

It's not going to be a pretty sight. A very foolish move by Yamaha, and I'm sure many in (Yamaha) Japan are embarrassed by it.

I do wonder though how much Dorna contributed (€) to this?

Anyone for Lorenzo @ Honda 2015-2016?

[Gar]

Lorenzo will not be bothered by Rossi, even if beaten on occasion. The more likely scenario would be Rossi retiring at the end of '13. Lorenzo is Yamaha's future.

[belleellis]

Sure these men have egos but I don't think they're going to act like petulant children (or I least I hope not).

I have a feeling Lorenzo is going to relish beating Rossi and will be happy to do it on equal machinery. I think Rossi will begin making his old chook jokes again and enjoy racing again and in particular shoving it in front of Lorenzo on the odd occasion.

I don't think it's that bad a move by Yamaha. Look what happened in 2010. Rossi was injured and not able to fight for the title but Lorenzo had a blinder of a year and brought it home. If Lorenzo were to get injured now Yamaha would have no chance at the title with Spies back in 10th. You can't put all your eggs in the one basket (but then again you can't play snooker with them either).

[jacques]

Fact of the matter is Yamaha now has 2 undisputed championship caliber riders on a undisputed championship caliber bike. Look forward to see how Rossi's test times are after Valencia...

[Grahluk]

Some of you guys are really silly. It's very simple. Yamaha wins. They get what they wanted back in '10 but now get it the way they wanted it. They get the most popular rider with the most championships in his era to finish his career on their bike effectively making him a brand ambassador for life. They get their current & future champ contender alongside. They get both on their terms. They get 1 maybe 2 title contenders for the next two years and more likely than scuttling each other they may likely get Factory blue on two podium steps every race. They will get major screen time & media focus. The Senna/Proust comparison was good. Factory Yamaha WILL be the story. Whoever loses out in the duel between 46 & 99 on track Yamaha wins. These conspiracies that one's going to be held back or given leftover seconds is silly. Yamaha's going to give both of them the absolute best bikes they can to go out and blast the field with Yamaha blue. It's the only logical thing as there are no sure things on race sunday. The only way to spoil Yamaha's party would be for Danni to step it up and deliver on that long investment and/or Marc to go gangbusters right out of the gate. Yamaha holds the aces. I doubt they'd play it as ridiculously as some of the speculations in this thread. I'm excited. Dorna just got an automatic renewal for my 2013 pass.

[Gustav O]

Some of you guys are really silly. It's very simple. Yamaha wins.
---snip--
Yamaha holds the aces. I doubt they'd play it as ridiculously as some of the speculations in this thread. I'm excited. Dorna just got an automatic renewal for my 2013 pass.

+1
I totally agree with this and I am also very sure that Lorenzo is the better of the two riders now. Not by much but by enough. Rossi has also learnt a lesson and I see no reason for him to make stupid shit. Will he take the win if can? Of course but he won´t risk it.

All people who think it is a bad move by Yamaha - who should they have signed to have a better team for the upcoming years?

Grooming talent for the time after Rossi will be done in Tech3.

[yzr-m1]

It's very simple. Yamaha wins.

In 2008, 2009 and 2010 Yamaha took back to back rider, team and manufacturer championships with the Rossi / Lorenzo "dream team" - Garage wall or not, when one didn't deliver the other was there to pick up the pieces. With all respect to other riders, signing Rossi for 2 years gives Yamaha the best chance of taking all 3 championships again - even if Rossi finishes 3rd every week behind Lorenzo and Pedrosa.

[Albert]

From this ---------



To this?????????

[Squidpuppet]

I have to agreed with those that think this is a poor decision (championship wise) by Yamaha, I don't think next year will be pretty. I think Jorge will have to shelve this gentlemens agreement about being nice on the track. Rossi has shown he doesn't have a problem with running someone wide to win, and if Jorge is in front of Rossi on the last lap I would put my money on Rossi to win. Yamaha have just painted a HUGE target on Jorge's leathers, his only hope is to be fast enough that he has a good gap. Not sure that that will happen too often.

I'll agree that the racing could get a little rugged. But let's not forget that Jorge had to learn how to be smooth and clean. His natural instincts of old were a little rugged themselves. We'll see how he reacts if things become scruffy on track.

[dave_m]

It's very simple. Yamaha wins.

In 2008, 2009 and 2010 Yamaha took back to back rider, team and manufacturer championships with the Rossi / Lorenzo "dream team" - Garage wall or not, when one didn't deliver the other was there to pick up the pieces. With all respect to other riders, signing Rossi for 2 years gives Yamaha the best chance of taking all 3 championships again - even if Rossi finishes 3rd every week behind Lorenzo and Pedrosa.

This is exactly right. For all the hard racing in from 2008 to 2010, does anyone remember either of them actually causing the the other rider to lose positions in the race? (Crash out, running off track, etc) Yamaha wants to win championships and this helps them do that, even if you think Lorenzo will beat Rossi, the manufacturer's and team titles shouldn't be ignored.

[Gar]

This is MotoGP - you guys seem to think that riders will be near each other on the track!

[Squidpuppet]

This is MotoGP - you guys seem to think that riders will be near each other on the track!

Motegi 2010

[Zaphod]

This is pretty far-fetched conspiracy theory nonsense.

What bit do you disagree with?
That Rossi will be number 2? Surely not.

Yes, that bit.
There is no way that Rossi is bringing sponsorship to the team without a guarantee of equal treatment from the factory. I'm quite sure he helped them see the difference between the '09-'10 seasons and what they had this year with Spies (if the rumors are true). Probably in return, Yamaha have said, "OK, but no "Wall" this time."
For now, both riders have made a public commitment to get along with each other and there is no doubt they both view each other as the one to beat. There is no reason for Yamaha to restrain either one of them, unless there is a points battle with someone else at the end of the season.

Maybe we're getting a bit "forest for the trees" here.

I see it being the same as Senna and Prost in the same team, and Jarvis maybe being as smart as Dennis. Two very competitive guys, out to beat each other at every race. If you can pull the reins in and stop them doing something stupid ending in a DNF for one or both bikes, you've guarenteed a top three finish from both machines (for arguments sake), hence the marketing comment.

The only real certainty though, is that they are going to be at each other (racing) from the get go...........and we should have some very exiting racing for 13.

.........and that Rossi will bring Yamaha a title sponsor.

[Cobbett]

I agree with the assessments that this is win-win for Yamaha - but I'm not persuaded by the Prost-Senna analogy (ie top team provides two very evenly matched rivals with equal equipment and says good luck), which keeps being made. Jarvis has gone out of his way to underline Jorge's no. 1 status, eg @

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/ ... si-return/

'Yamaha's MotoGP boss Lin Jarvis is emphatic that Lorenzo "is our #1 rider" and nothing will be done to destabilize his campaign to win the 2013 championship. Not only will Rossi now be understudy to Lorenzo, the rider who forced him to leave Yamaha because he was so fast in 2010, he had to accept a pay cut. "Our main investment is in Jorge and Jorge is the #1 candidate to be champion both this year and definitely the #1 candidate to be champion next year," Jarvis said. "So it is very important to give Jorge full support. There is nothing we will do to put Jorge's chance of success into jeopardy and this is a very important consideration." ... Lorenzo has remained loyal to Yamaha and his desires will be paramount in deciding Yamaha team politics. For his part Lorenzo says he has no problems with Rossi returning and he was one of the first to know about the plan ... Jarvis confirmed that it was crucial to have Lorenzo on the same page as he worked the deal to get Rossi back. "Jorge is our #1 rider so for any decision to change the team we would always consult Jorge to gain his opinion and to explain our thoughts. This is a normal process," Jarvis said.'

How far VR will be content to play along with this is of course another matter. But re the Prost/Senna analogy which keeps coming out, I don't remember Ron Dennis coming out with remarks like that about either of them; it's plainly not how Jarvis sees it.

[GD66]

Wonder whether there's a "dividing wall" clause included in the new contract ?

[Grahluk]

I agree with the assessments that this is win-win for Yamaha - but I'm not persuaded by the Prost-Senna analogy (ie top team provides two very evenly matched rivals with equal equipment and says good luck), which keeps being made. Jarvis has gone out of his way to underline Jorge's no. 1 status, eg @

http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/ ... si-return/

'Yamaha's MotoGP boss Lin Jarvis is emphatic that Lorenzo "is our #1 rider" and nothing will be done to destabilize his campaign to win the 2013 championship. Not only will Rossi now be understudy to Lorenzo, the rider who forced him to leave Yamaha because he was so fast in 2010, he had to accept a pay cut. "Our main investment is in Jorge and Jorge is the #1 candidate to be champion both this year and definitely the #1 candidate to be champion next year," Jarvis said. "So it is very important to give Jorge full support. There is nothing we will do to put Jorge's chance of success into jeopardy and this is a very important consideration." ... Lorenzo has remained loyal to Yamaha and his desires will be paramount in deciding Yamaha team politics. For his part Lorenzo says he has no problems with Rossi returning and he was one of the first to know about the plan ... Jarvis confirmed that it was crucial to have Lorenzo on the same page as he worked the deal to get Rossi back. "Jorge is our #1 rider so for any decision to change the team we would always consult Jorge to gain his opinion and to explain our thoughts. This is a normal process," Jarvis said.'

How far VR will be content to play along with this is of course another matter. But re the Prost/Senna analogy which keeps coming out, I don't remember Ron Dennis coming out with remarks like that about either of them; it's plainly not how Jarvis sees it.

All that's saying is that it's not going to be like it was. Lorenzo gets say in who his teammate is. Yamaha wanted Rossi. They let Jorge be part of the decision. He said he has no problem. That's it. Understudy? What kind of crap line is that? Start thinking the present Honda team & you'll see the likely arrangement of Yamaha next year. Stoner is Honda's #1 but they're not short changing Danni.

[Gar]

Wonder whether there's a "dividing wall" clause included in the new contract ?

I don't think Rossi is in a position to make demands, and I think Yamaha will want data sharing.

[ieism]

Ah, Lin Jarvis gives me the creeps.

But you're right, the Senna Prost situation will not be allowed to happen as far as Yamaha is concerned. But believing Rossi will play by Jarvis rules is just plain funny.

You think Senna listened to anybody? I remember they had a gentleman's agreement not too fight eachother after the first corner of a race. That lasted exactly two corners.

If Rossi thinks he can beat Jorge, he will do so. There is nothing that Jarvis can do about that. They can give him a slower bike, but the press will be all over that and Rossi will use that to pressure them. Yamaha should know how this works by now.

The best they can do is like McLaren at the time, just let them race and rake in the sponsorship money.

[Zaphod]

Yep....... that's what I meant.

2013 should be good. Would imagine after the last two years that Rossi is as hungry as hell for wins/title.

Going to enjoy sitting back and watching what happens on the track.

Jarvis saying "Lorenzo is the #1 rider" is old hat.......Rossi will be there in MotoGP for what, 2 years tops ? For the future success of the team, they're hardly going to say anything different , are they ?



Q...... who took, or is taking, the vacant Duc seat ?

[sir_nj]

a little too much conspiracy theory going on here.

Yamaha haven't had a title sponsor and they could do with one so why not take Rossi?

Lorenzo and Rossi were not "mates" as team mates but they never knocked each other off (neither have Stoner or Pedrosa for that matter) and won't be out to do it when they are re-teamed.

Lorenzo would likely welcome the challenge to show that he can beat Rossi on equal machinary when they are both healthy.

There is unlikely to be any major direction changes for the bike in terms of development as it is proving to be a very refined tool right now so massive changes favoured by one of the riders and not the other are unlikely.

Rossi, Lorenzo and Pedrosa are all very seasoned MotoGP riders who are out there to win, they know and respect each others abilities they expect to be given decent equipment and a chance to prove themselves and if you happen to be on the same team they would expect the other rider to make up their own decision and also to stick up for themselves. Stoner and Pedrosa have gone their separate ways more than once this year when it comes to selecting equipment - frame and tyres.

The only impediment I can see for Lorenzo is Rossi's hangers on may be quite distracting..