2012 Round 2 Jerez Race Topic **Spoilers**

[Cam D]

Casey on his arm pump.

The arm pump at Silverstone in 2010 was a “little bit less than it was today. In Qatar it was the worst I’ve ever had it and much worse than Silverstone.

Read more: http://www.sportrider.com/news/146_1205 ... z1thcDFBxw

[Hanuman]

They sure have different riding styles but they are also at different parts of the corner in those pics.

Agreed, Gustav.
In addition, I'd wager the riding style/hanging off is as much about Stoner's purported ability to pick the bike up onto the contact patch as any CoG effects.
Then again, unravelling what these guys do to go so fast is beyond my ken.

[Rusty Bucket USA]

They sure have different riding styles but they are also at different parts of the corner in those pics.

If you look at where Stoner is in the first one, and where Lorenzo is in the second, they are close. The point was, if you watch the corner the whole way through on video, it's rarely so obvious how different Stoner is to everyone else. Only Pedrosa ever gets his shoulders that far outside his elbows; we probably all assume he does that because he is so small, but Stoner does it more. And then, only Elias ever gets his whole body further out of the seat.

[tom]

It's hard to capture in stills what was happening in this sequence, but seen in real-time, sometimes I'm still surprised just how far off the bike Stoner gets:

(link to slightly larger original)

(link to slightly larger original)
(Big credit to RedJet for the screen-captures. Thank you!)

That is a fantastic capture of the difference in riding styles! Im not saying one is better than the other, just that in that corner, they are very different. There is, like you say, a huge difference between the amount both riders are hanging off but also there is a big difference in the direction the bikes are heading.

The position of CS in pic one does seem very similar to the position of JL in pic two i.e. they appear to be in the same spot on the track so comparisons to a certain extent should be accurate.

Casey appears to have his bike turned already and on the gas while Jorge still isn't pointing at the exit. For Casey to be on the gas this much earlier and yet the two are so close together in lap times, must mean Jorge is running a lot more mid corner speed. All quite obvious i know but those pics really do highlight it and are an amazing study in completely different ways of getting around a track at MotoGP leading pace.

[lebowski]

It's like Stoner is able to, for want of a better word, get the rear to slide toward the outside of the corner while maintaining grip at the front, thereby getting the front of the bike pointed where he wants it to go early and thereby allowing him to stand it up and get on the gas even harder. In that way the understeer of the Duc didn't affect him to the same degree (but the committed nature of his style contributed to losing the front at times).

[Zaphod]

I put it down to a mis-spent youth riding and racing motorcross, then moving to GP bikes and having no respect for just what you are and are'nt allowed to do with a road racing bike.

In all seriousness though, picking it up early onto the larger contact patch whilst remaining largely off the bike to spread CoG really reminds me alot of watching one M.Doohan in action.

As much as they are different, very similar in some ways.Especially in that shot........could almost be Doohan if you squint hard enough.

Different bikes, weights,tyres and power........similar style.

[Sloth27]

The wide angle of that shot is one of my favourite motorsport photos ever. Doohan looks so casual on the 'bars, almost like he is not even trying. Plenty of interesting comparisons to make between the two, both on and off the bike.

[WayneG]

I put it down to a mis-spent youth riding and racing motorcross

Just a small correction, he actually predominantly raced dirt track rather than motocross. He won over 90 dirt track titles, many at our local track, before he left Australia at 14 which is why sliding is second nature to him. Gary McCoy had a similar background although he went on to speedway.

[RedJet]

In reading an article on SPEED.com regarding the cracked frame on Ben Spies' bike...

For some reason the crack was not discovered until they arrived in Jerez - that's 3 weeks after Qatar, right? I'm doing the math right - yes?

They brought the same frame, not a new one. Am I alone in wondering how in 3 weeks time Yamaha et al could not find and or replace a cracked frame? And how would that delay and uncertainty play on Ben?

They fixed the problem - doesn't sound like it was replaced, before race (I'm assuming!) in Jerez. But damn people. If I were Ben I'd be wondering if that thing really was fixed all weekend long.

Here is the quote from Jarvis:

"The crack was really difficult to see and the seat itself wasn't damaged. But the crack was in the black area of the carbon midway underneath. We found that at Jerez and cured the problem and there was no chatter,"

A little duct-tape, some bailing wire, gum and a black sharpie and we'll have that fixed up tight Ben, don't you worry none...Now you go out and have a good race y'hear?

Oh, and hey Ben... !




Link to article on SPEED.com
http://moto-racing.speedtv.com/article/motogp-spies-seeks-saving-grace

[Cam D]

Doesn't surprise me a bit, and it's garbage at that level. I have felt his team hasn't been up to scratch for a while. I reckon Jarvis needs to pull his head in, I can't believe he's publicly having a go at Spies! He may not be winning at the moment but the guy has serious potential and just needs a bit of time. We've all seen riders go through similar times before. Jarvis should try being a bit more supportive and let him to get on with the job. jmo

[Zaphod]

+1

I mentioned in the Ducati topic....... Jarvis is bugging me at the moment.

That is really poor form, in regards to his attitude to Spies, and his bike. Be funny to watch if Lorenzo left and went somewhere else.

[Nachlauf]

Doesn't surprise me a bit, and it's garbage at that level. I have felt his team hasn't been up to scratch for a while. I reckon Jarvis needs to pull his head in, I can't believe he's publicly having a go at Spies! He may not be winning at the moment but the guy has serious potential and just needs a bit of time. We've all seen riders go through similar times before. Jarvis should try being a bit more supportive and let him to get on with the job. jmo

Indeed. But it's not only Jarvis. There are countless journos out there, mainly from Britain, who are doing the same all the time. Ben started his MotoGP adventure together with SuperSic. In 2010 both were on satellite bikes. And in 2011 both were on factory spec. About Marco they write their mindless stories as if he had scored serious podiums, not to mention any wins. And about Ben they mostly write as if he was as bad as Elias. Don't get me wrong, I don't expect them to write negative pieces on Marco. I just think they should keep their biased perspectives a bit straighter...

Of course the journos are not Ben's employers. Jarvis is. Imho he has a big responsibility too. Like providing working machinery. Qatar was a huge let down (electrics, chatter). Finding out it took them 3 weeks to locate the issue doesn't make the team look fantastic either. Maybe Jarvis should shut up and do the contract talking when it's due. As should the journos.

[Rusty Bucket USA]

+1, and +1
I don't think Lorenzo is going to leave because of Jarvis; if anything, Jarvis' behavior (whatever it really is) is because of fixation on Lorenzo. It isn't Jarvis' fault that no one in the Spies garage thought to use any of the 3 weeks' time to inspect the parts on two bikes that had taken major tumbles (especially when the rider suspected serious problems). He is going through the motions of making it clear that he can't be soft on the token American in his fleet.