MOTM Indy ***spoliers***

[JanBros]

MOTM : no doubt : Stoner

DOTM : Ducati/Elias combo. Tony's fastest lap was his third, probably because there still was some heat in his tires from the tire warmers
If Tony is still on the Duck next race, why bother showing up as a team, just stay home ...

[MiniNinjaMk5]

It's only a disappointment if you don't expect it right? I would have put my mortgage on Elias tootling around at the bottom of the teens and fighting with the CRTs. I agree though in that sense it does seem kind of pointless - the Eurosport guys were speculating on bringing in Jacob Smrz from the Effenbert Liberty Ducati team in WSB to race at what would be a 'home round' at Brno. As that team aren't travelling to Moscow for the WSB round next weekend, surely he would be worth a try?

MOTM: Stoner, herculean effort. Surely he would not have been able to take his place on the podium after the race had he finished 3rd, that must have been absolute agony for him.

HM: Pedrosa - yes perhaps it was his to lose, but lap record pace for most of the race. I have never seen him look so extroverted and happy with victory. Julian Ryder commented that so much of professional sports are confidence and run of form, and Pedrosa certainly has both of those right now.

DOTM: Spies - you couldn't make this stuff up, if I were him I would be seriously considering whether or not I would want to finish the season on that bike.

DOTM HM: Rossi - absolute waste of time. I can kind of understand him not wanting to roll up that embankment into the wall, but at the same time it is so dis-spiriting to see him ride around as last of the CRTs.

[dave_m]

MOTM: Stoner and Spies, both were right up there after brutal highsides in qualifying.

DOTM: Indy and Bridgestone. There's no reason the surface should be that slick, but if it is then they need to bring better/different tires.

[CLX]

Stoner, Spies.

Lorenzo sure looked nothing like his usual form this weekend, but the luck of champions. People mess up, or get messed up, he picks it up. Textbook stuff.

[motor]

MOTM : Stoner. Can't stand the guy, but bloody hell...respect.
DOTM : Rossi. I cheer for the guy, but what the f...dismal.

[Richo]

MOTM - Hard to go past Stoner seeing as I wasn't even expecting him to race. That would have been a very tough race.

DOTM - Any Yamaha with a number 11 on it.

[Cam D]

MOTM: Casey for sure.

DOTM: Yamaha for their treatmet of Ben Spies. (check out the Spies thread)

[yzr750]

Motm Spies for still giving his all, even though he's being f'ed over.
Dotm, Rossi for the complete opposite, 57s behind the leader, either race the thing or walk away.

[Nachlauf]

motm is Stoner for me. Almost came third despite his pain and battered ankle.

dotm is Rossi. Seriously, go hard or go home...

[Rossifumi]

MotM - as with Crutchlow at Silverstone, Stoner performed way beyond expectations so is an easy choice.
DotM - Rossi.....I really hope it's just the bike.....

[Japhrodisiac]

How does an engine blowing up make someone a DOTM? hardly under his control

[Rossifumi]

How does an engine blowing up make someone a DOTM? hardly under his control

is this directed against me? did Rossi's engine blow up?

[Squidpuppet]

How does an engine blowing up make someone a DOTM? hardly under his control

D= disappointment. It is not a slag.

[marianbv]

Motm Spies for still giving his all, even though he's being fucked over.
Dotm, Rossi for the complete opposite, 57s behind the leader, either race the thing or walk away.

I don't even understand why Ducati doesn't try to swap Rossi for Spies for the rest of the season - that would be a media blower! And maybe, just maybe ...

[dave_m]

Wow, people still have expectations for the Rossi/Ducati combo this year? Here are the top finishing Ducati position in the dry races so far this year: 6, 8, 7, 7, 7, 6, 6, 5, 6, 7. Why would it change when there haven't been any significant updates to the bike? (It's hard to be disappointed if you don't expect very much from the Ducati riders.)

[yzr750]

Wow, people still have expectations for the Rossi/Ducati combo this year? Here are the top finishing Ducati position in the dry races so far this year: 6, 8, 7, 7, 7, 6, 6, 5, 6, 7. Why would it change when there haven't been any significant updates to the bike? (It's hard to be disappointed if you don't expect very much from the Ducati riders.)

Not expecting race wins etc, but I do expect the riders to give it their all, otherwise why bother? This isn't some club race, this is supposedly the pinnacle of the sport, and i don't want to see riders going through the motions just because they have not got the best equipment.

[Nachlauf]

i don't want to see riders going through the motions just because they have not got the best equipment.

Exactly. Not expecting Rossi to fight for wins. But he could at least try to beat the satellite Hondas and Yamahas. But finishing half a minute behind them and then having the nerves to tell everyone he was just cruising around is a shame. If he can't be arsed to give his best he should quit. I'm pretty sure there are a few guys who'd put in more effort...

[Zaphod]

With respect to you two.

Trying to beat the sattelite jap bikes didn't do Hayden any favours..... Worked well for Barbera too..........

Lets put a few things into perspective.

It's a circuit most of the riders have problems with, some with it's tricky lay out, most with the surface. The Ducati's a pile. Got a second life starting next season.

He started this current incarnation all banged up, possibly compounding the initial period of riding/developing/whatever the Duc.

Why would you go out and bust your nuts on a bike and a track that both don't work ?

So we can sit around applaude, as is now the case, "Oh how brave that Casey is !" from on high ?

Bet he'd swap your admiration and praise for 15 to 25 points..... and to be fully fit for the next races.



Rossi's come out and said he can't ride the thing......just can't gel with it, admiting what people wanted him to admit. Now it seems people won't be happy till he throws himself off.

Funny thing is, when Hayden falls it's admirable, as he's really trying.

When Rossi falls off the thing, it's just proof that he's washed up, not as good as..............


Speedy and thorough recovery wishes to Casey, Nicky and Hector.

[dave_m]

i don't want to see riders going through the motions just because they have not got the best equipment.

Exactly. Not expecting Rossi to fight for wins. But he could at least try to beat the satellite Hondas and Yamahas. But finishing half a minute behind them and then having the nerves to tell everyone he was just cruising around is a shame. If he can't be arsed to give his best he should quit. I'm pretty sure there are a few guys who'd put in more effort...

At least use the whole quotes when trying to make your point, as Rossi said he could have been closer to Bradl, but would have crashed trying to keep up with him. Every rider out there slows down when they know their position is fixed, and that they aren't going to catch the rider in front of them.

“I don’t know if it is the worst race of my career but I give up very much. After two or three laps I have two or three moments on the front and now the problem is that everybody is fast. Sixth place was 25 seconds ahead of me so if you want to go you have to push a lot. After the two big moments I don’t want to crash another time and I saw I was in seventh place and I just cruised with the bike not to make any mistake like in Laguna. But anyway it is a big, big disaster. In the morning the bike was not so bad like yesterday (Saturday) and I can stay in the 40.5 and 40.7 pace and ride very smooth but in the afternoon the rear tyre slides very much and I don’t have any chance. Each time I try to go faster I just spin more and I go slower. It is a difficult situation but we don’t have to give up.”

My point is just who gives a crap where the Ducati riders finish? (Either Hayden or Rossi) If everything goes right then they are racing for 6th or 7th. Rossi finished 7th, pretty much what everyone should be expecting by now. Rossi almost had the same crash as Hayden during qualifying, so pushing harder on the Ducati was getting him nowhere. I don't see the point of pushing the current GP12 to get closer to 6th place. And did Rossi really have a worse result than Hayden at Indianapolis? How about Brno?

[Zaphod]

For any Ducati rider, barring Stoner 07, how do you push on and try on a bike that you know is going to bite you ?

A bike that isn't even predictable ,to any extent, in regards to what inputs will make it bite you ? The thing seems to move it's goal posts corner by corner the harder you push it.

Stoner and Dani, for example, can have some confidence in their mounts, as the chatter is known. They know how it affects the bike, and what inputs make it happen. Doesn't mean they like it, or that it's no biggy....... but they can, to a certain extent, live with it.

Nobody has any confidence in the Duc, because they don't know when it will do bad things......only that it will.


Where any Duc rider gets the thing to finish is a comedable effort.


As for Elias, sure.......bad record in MotoGP, but chuck any moto2 rider on that Duc at short notice and see where they put it.


To easy to critique.......

[yzr750]

Forget placings, it's the lack of effort that shits me.
Fact, Rossi is a superior rider to hayden, there is no disputing that, yet Hayden was over a second quicker than Rossin in QP, and has outqualified him in 9 of the 11 races so far, you have to ask why?
Rossi is currently only 7 points ahead of his team mate in the championship, exactly the same amount as he finished ahead of him in last years championship, all on identical machinery.
So, what are the conclusions we can draw from this?
A. Rossi has suddenly 'lost it'' I don't think so
B. Hayden has suddenly upped his game to be on a par with Rossi? I don't think so
C Rossi is not trying as hard as he could? I think probably the case.
Don't give me this bullshit about not pushing because he's going to end up in the dirt, why should he push on a bike to get 6th place etc, that's what these guys do, they push their bikes to the limit, it just so happens that some bikes have a higher limit than others.
If he isn't there to push it to the limits, go play golf for a while, and give the bike to someone that's going to give it a go.

[Zaphod]

I see no difference (their personal slanging matches aside) between Stoner , the last year on it in particular, and Rossi.

Hayden was outplacing and qualifying Stoner.

I can empathise with both, whether I'm right or wrong, that you get to a point where if they're not coming up with solutions....or even looking like they are willing to, then why bother busting your arse for it ?

For your own sake ?....do the risks outweigh the benifits ?...and Ducati's "He should thank us" comment in regards to Stoners miracles performed shows where the ego's really lie.

As soon as his dream ride became open.....Stoner left.

Yeah, Rossi shot his mouth off...whoop-de-doo.....nothing new there. Though given what he had already achieved in his career, it wasn't without some belief they could it...cocky or not.

I don't know what drives Nicky.....lack of a viable alternative ? That kept Stoner there for probably longer than he wanted to be.

You ask yourself what other GP team, factory or not, has been through 24 riders in 9 years ?

Stoner, Rossi and Hayden deserve commendations for sticking out their contracts, and having remarkably few negative comments about Ducati.

It's more than that factory deserve.

All my references to Ducati imply the factory and management....not the respective crews of the riders mentioned.

Good luck to anyone who thinks this (Ducati) will turn around in a year or two.

[yzr750]

I see no difference (their personal slanging matches aside) between Stoner , the last year on it in particular, and Rossi.

Hayden was outplacing and qualifying Stoner.

You are completely missing my point, the point is not why he is not pushing the bike, it is the fact he isn't, and if he isn't pushing it to it's limit, he shouldn't be racing at the pinnacle of the sport.

[indestructibleman]

Forget placings, it's the lack of effort that shits me.
Fact, Rossi is a superior rider to hayden, there is no disputing that, yet Hayden was over a second quicker than Rossin in QP, and has outqualified him in 9 of the 11 races so far, you have to ask why?
Rossi is currently only 7 points ahead of his team mate in the championship, exactly the same amount as he finished ahead of him in last years championship, all on identical machinery.
So, what are the conclusions we can draw from this?
A. Rossi has suddenly 'lost it'' I don't think so
B. Hayden has suddenly upped his game to be on a par with Rossi? I don't think so
C Rossi is not trying as hard as he could? I think probably the case.
Don't give me this bullshit about not pushing because he's going to end up in the dirt, why should he push on a bike to get 6th place etc, that's what these guys do, they push their bikes to the limit, it just so happens that some bikes have a higher limit than others.
If he isn't there to push it to the limits, go play golf for a while, and give the bike to someone that's going to give it a go.

D. The problems with the Ducati are a leveling factor that cuts Valentino's lead over Nicky. The lesser capabilities of the bike make the margin between the two smaller. Also, Nicky's style may simply be better suited to the bike.

[indestructibleman]

I see no difference (their personal slanging matches aside) between Stoner , the last year on it in particular, and Rossi.

Hayden was outplacing and qualifying Stoner.

You are completely missing my point, the point is not why he is not pushing the bike, it is the fact he isn't, and if he isn't pushing it to it's limit, he shouldn't be racing at the pinnacle of the sport.

let's see how he does on a capable bike next year and then ask whether he should be racing at the pinnacle of the sport.