Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Richo on Fri Jul 15, 2011 2:29 pm

rick wrote:Ditto, and you have to be of a certain age (vintage ?? :o ) to remember Aunty Jack. (and I was very, very young at the time ;) )


Yes, like yourself rick, I was definitely quite young myself when this came out. Still fond memories though.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby sir_nj on Sat Jul 16, 2011 1:06 am

Richo wrote:
rick wrote:Ditto, and you have to be of a certain age (vintage ?? :o ) to remember Aunty Jack. (and I was very, very young at the time ;) )


Yes, like yourself rick, I was definitely quite young myself when this came out. Still fond memories though.


now I'm starting to feel old since I was actually old enough (11 I think) to go and see the stage show live.

ipso wrote:I say we create a subculture here at MM - open up another unique dimension -


you stay there john big bootie, I'll go get me overthruster.

I think the subculture is already right here in this very thread :) and I have enjoyed reading other people's take on the interview with the odd bits of historical reference points thrown in to either back up their argument or help the rest of us see where the comments are coming from.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby ipso on Sat Jul 16, 2011 2:49 am

sir_nj wrote:you stay there john big bootie, I'll go get me overthruster.

"...It's BigbooTAYE, TAYE, TAYE!"

sir_nj wrote:I think the subculture is already right here in this very thread :)

I'm not just talking deep analysis - I'm talking picking one single best performer on the weekend. MotM-O (off track). Colin's stage performance would be a win for that week - IMO. A DotM-O example would be Pedrosa rejecting Simoncelli's handshake on camera.

But those are extreme examples. Generally it would be in the form of an interview that gives the audience a much deeper understanding of the 'show' – what rider has the best off-track performance.

Nah - it probably wouldn't work. Never mind. :cry:
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby TwoStroke Institute on Sat Jul 16, 2011 4:03 am

WayneG wrote:Oscar, I'm not sure whether to laugh or come round there and rip your bloody arms off! :D


Bugger you beat me to it.

Still think Norman Gunston (and Slick Mick from Jindavik)was the stand out

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8mh8HThN ... re=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T47Ivf4p ... re=related
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Squidpuppet on Sat Jul 16, 2011 11:46 pm

ipso wrote:[I'm talking picking one single best performer on the weekend. MotM-O (off track). Colin's stage performance would be a win for that week - IMO. A DotM-O example would be Pedrosa rejecting Simoncelli's handshake on camera.

But those are extreme examples. Generally it would be in the form of an interview that gives the audience a much deeper understanding of the 'show' – what rider has the best off-track performance.

Nah - it probably wouldn't work. Never mind. :cry:


I like it. It could be done in the Off Track thread.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:44 am

Ummmmmm, probably going to cop some flack over this, but.........

I thought , although rather more bluntly put than I would, Schwantzs assesment of the Simmo/Pedrobot incident was a fair call. If he had been able to maitain his line, then he would have gotten around the corner. I waited till I found some decent footage before forming an opinion on this. This slow mo I found of the telecast footage ( thanks Mr Italian guy) shows.........back wheel in the air, and thus counter-steering off his line and placing him in a "hit Marco" position.

Watch, and see what you think.

http://youtu.be/vVVvDGFpj-k

Now, to add to that, if you were being caught at the rate Dani was (and being dropped by the front blokes at the same rate), do you have a red hot go straight back a few laps later, or see if you can follow someone who must have used more tyre than you to get there, with the intent of sussing out where he's faster than you, and vice-versa, in an effort to nail him later on, when his tyres are even worse ?

This is especially the case if the bloke you're going to stick it to has a reputation for .........lets call it hard riding. :lol: :lol:

He should have been smarter, he's been around a lot longer, and has by virtue more experience.

Racing incident............

I agreed entirely with his comment " I didn't waste my time or breath, I just had to figure out how to f#$%ing beat them on the track !"...............

Too much "He said-she said" type crap these days.

It took Doohan10 ( was it 11 ?) years to break Schwantz's race lap record ( which was faster than the qualifying lap record) at Assen....(2:02;211).....with the track having being shortened, and a big bang engine. Stoner beating Schwantz's record, or any of the top blokes from that era.........well.....traction control, four stroke etc, etc, etc...........you'd hope so wouldn't you ??


I say he's ( and any of those blokes) earnt the right to be a crotchety , opinionated old man. Doesn't mean they are 100% right........but they have lived that life, we haven't.........


Right, blindfold on, last ciggarette........fire away ! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Richo on Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:14 pm

Zaphod wrote:It took Doohan10 ( was it 11 ?) years to break Schwantz's race lap record ( which was faster than the qualifying lap record) at Assen....(2:02;211).....with the track having being shortened, and a big bang engine. Stoner beating Schwantz's record, or any of the top blokes from that era.........well.....traction control, four stroke etc, etc, etc...........you'd hope so wouldn't you ??


I'm sure the talk isn't about Stoner beating any of Schwantz's lap records but his number of wins. Stoner isn't competing against 500cc 2 strokes but bikes of the same era. Not sure what you are getting at here.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:25 pm

Ah, someone a few posts back had a stab at Schwantz on the grounds Stoner's beaten his number of race wins as away of proving anything he ( schwantz) might say is irrelevant......couldn't be bothered quoting it.

Would have helped with the relevance side of things , re, my point.

I am of the same opinion as you. Different era.........
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Tormo4ever on Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:26 pm

i reckon had dani been smarter, he would ve been taken down just a few milliseconds later than he was
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Kropotkin on Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:45 pm

Zaphod wrote:Ummmmmm, probably going to cop some flack over this, but.........

I thought , although rather more bluntly put than I would, Schwantzs assesment of the Simmo/Pedrobot incident was a fair call. If he had been able to maitain his line, then he would have gotten around the corner. I waited till I found some decent footage before forming an opinion on this. This slow mo I found of the telecast footage ( thanks Mr Italian guy) shows.........back wheel in the air, and thus counter-steering off his line and placing him in a "hit Marco" position.



Simoncelli was never going to get round that corner. It was 100% Simoncelli's fault. Ride-through is a little harsh, but if you are catching Pedrosa at a rate of knots, and apparently able to pass him at will, why choose the most bone-headed place to do so and make a wild pass? If he'd waited until the final corner or the chicane, he would have blasted by and Pedrosa would have been toast.

However, Simoncelli's record speaks for itself: when he rides a sensible race, he gets 5th or 6th. When he goes all out he runs at the front, until he crashes or does something stupid. Nobody doubts his speed, he's just never going to be a champion. Or at least, not in the MotoGP class up against the level of competition we have at the moment.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby TwoStroke Institute on Tue Jul 19, 2011 2:39 pm

Zaphod wrote:Ummmmmm, probably going to cop some flack over this, but.........

I thought , although rather more bluntly put than I would, Schwantzs assesment of the Simmo/Pedrobot incident was a fair call. If he had been able to maitain his line, then he would have gotten around the corner. I waited till I found some decent footage before forming an opinion on this. This slow mo I found of the telecast footage ( thanks Mr Italian guy) shows.........back wheel in the air, and thus counter-steering off his line and placing him in a "hit Marco" position.

Watch, and see what you think.

http://youtu.be/vVVvDGFpj-k

Now, to add to that, if you were being caught at the rate Dani was (and being dropped by the front blokes at the same rate), do you have a red hot go straight back a few laps later, or see if you can follow someone who must have used more tyre than you to get there, with the intent of sussing out where he's faster than you, and vice-versa, in an effort to nail him later on, when his tyres are even worse ?

This is especially the case if the bloke you're going to stick it to has a reputation for .........lets call it hard riding. :lol: :lol:

He should have been smarter, he's been around a lot longer, and has by virtue more experience.

Racing incident............

I agreed entirely with his comment " I didn't waste my time or breath, I just had to figure out how to f#$%ing beat them on the track !"...............

Too much "He said-she said" type crap these days.

It took Doohan10 ( was it 11 ?) years to break Schwantz's race lap record ( which was faster than the qualifying lap record) at Assen....(2:02;211).....with the track having being shortened, and a big bang engine. Stoner beating Schwantz's record, or any of the top blokes from that era.........well.....traction control, four stroke etc, etc, etc...........you'd hope so wouldn't you ??


I say he's ( and any of those blokes) earnt the right to be a crotchety , opinionated old man. Doesn't mean they are 100% right........but they have lived that life, we haven't.........


Right, blindfold on, last ciggarette........fire away ! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Schwantz was the only rider current or ex to leap to Simoncelli's defence. As Kroppers said when he holds it together he finishes 5th or 6th and Spies just waits till the last corner to pass him. Ben is smart enough to realise that's the lap that they classify you on.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Richo on Tue Jul 19, 2011 11:39 pm

TwoStroke Institute wrote:Ben is smart enough to realise that's the lap that they classify you on.


Quote of the week TSI :)
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Squidpuppet on Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:01 am

Kropotkin wrote:Simoncelli was never going to get round that corner.


Devils advocate. :D Sic had a wider entry, a more squared off trajectory, and tipped in later. Would Dani have made the corner?
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby JanBros on Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:33 am

can we leave the Simocelli/Pedrosa incident behind us now ?

everything has been said bye now :| , (sorry for the newcomers :mrgreen: )
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby redmike34 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 12:51 am

Haha--okay JanBros, I just deleted my long post on that subject for you--I'll just say I'm on Schwantz's, Zaphod's and Squid's side. Racing incident.

By the way, Zaphod--no one ever beat Schwantz's 1991 race lap record at Assen. The last chance anyone had was 2001, as they changed the track for 2002. Rossi was within a couple of tenths that year, and Okada had come even closer in 1999, but no dice. He also set a record at Jerez that stood for six years, and it was a LONG time before anyone beat his record at Laguna. Whatever else you can say about the guy--lack of consistency, ADD, not the sharpest knife in the drawer, whatever--he was one of the most talented guys to ever ride a GP bike. Considering that he did all that on a Suzuki, too--it's similar to Stoner and the Duck. The record books may have looked much different had he rode for Honda or Yamaha.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Richo on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:16 am

redmike34 wrote:Considering that he did all that on a Suzuki...


Don't discount Kenny Roberts Jnr then, he did the same thing.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:37 am

My opinion as well on the records Redmike, but that's all it is...........apples and oranges. Richo, KRj did a stella job....all the rubbish about winning it by finishing second all the time was crap. He was smart about his approach......... not as spectacular to watch as schwantz.......but a smarter approach.

I didn't see it as a case of Schwantz leaping to anyones defence, more case of pointing out a few truths.

1. Danni should have been smarter. Given the reference to Spies a few posts back, Simmo's know history, and Danni's experience.........he bloody well should have been smarter !.......easy to say when you don't have the red mist down though...

but as it has been pointed out, Spies approach to dealing with Simmo is smarter........and he's been in GP's for a whole lot less time than Danni............So-o-o-o..........

Who was, or was not going to make the corner is a moot point, that has been done to death....although the laws of physics dictate, if you are at the same ( or similar) speed, on a tighter trajectory, you are going to run wider on the exit than the bloke who takes a later apex, squaring off the corner. This allows him to run a tighter exit............ now, the rest is a discussion that would go on for eons......

2. There have been other .........how do you put this ?......hard riders ( or dickheads..depends on how you want to quantify them), Stoner, Lorenzo and Pedrosa should just suck it up, and as Schwantz said ....." figure out how to beat them on the
f#$%ing track"

Fair call..............quit moaning about it.....ride your bike.

Beattie has said the same, as have a lot of other ex riders. Their comments only give ammunition to the fact that they ( Stoner, Lorenzo, Danni) are acting like Girls.

An example of the same type of incident.......actually...it's bloody uncannilly similar !!!


http://youtu.be/8wMlZyByj2g

What did Lawson say about it ?........" it was pretty stupid, and I was going to go over and punch him in the head........then I saw he was in a fair bit of pain, so the job had already been done for me "

Did he crap on about "dangerous", and "Should be banned/Jailed to the media for months afterwards, or any time Schwantz fell off ???

No........... He got on with his job, and learnt a thing or two about what to do next time he was dicing with Schwantz to avoid a repeat performance.

Suck it up girls !

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Last edited by Zaphod on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby redmike34 on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:52 am

Richo wrote:
redmike34 wrote:Considering that he did all that on a Suzuki...


Don't discount Kenny Roberts Jnr then, he did the same thing.

Haha... are you serious or funning me? If you're serious, I can provide you with a detailed explanation for why I disagree with you in principle...
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Richo on Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:57 am

I was merely stating a fact. You mentioned that Schwantz won his title on the inferior Suzuki. I just mentioned that Roberts also won on a 500cc Suzuki, so therefore he shouldn't be discounted. Roberts also beat Rossi into 2nd that year. Plenty to read into it I'm sure, but I'm not trying to create an argument, just stating facts. Personally I think Schwantz was a brilliant rider to watch and really admired him when he was racing.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:01 am

Two different bikes, two different era's............. KRj did have a smart approach to his efforts............an approach Schwantz took on after Rainey's accident. If the bike can do it, I will do it........if it ain't there....I'm not hurting myself anymore.

Schwantz, like Doohan, Gardner and others.....did not know how to stop/slow the pace a bit.....win, win, win...go, go, go...push, push push.

People like Rainey and Lawson were much more analytical in their approach.

An example........race wins, Schwantz 25...Rainey, 24........Titles, Rainey 3...Schwantz 1.

Schwantz is my all time favorite, for a lot of reasons.....but facts are facts.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Cam D on Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:23 am

Seriously..... IMO calling these guys pussies and little girls has to be the biggest load I have ever heard anyone go on with, I don't care who says it.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:42 am

Well, to Quote Donald "duck" Dunn........"If the shit fits, wear it"

With the exception of Doohan from time to time, no buch of riders has moaned more in the history of the sport.

....Well,..Phil "bloody" Read..... :lol: :lol: :lol:

Sheene and Roberts used to moan about getting better conditions and pay for ALL the riders.........and about each other.

No one previously in the history of the sport had the ability for the bike to be set up via a lap top to dial in just the right amount of wheelspin to avoid a highside etc, regardless of what you do with the throttle.

No riders in history had the level of safety at circuits that these guys currently enjoy, and are entitled to.

All these are good things, and thoroughly deserved. Dickhead ( dangerous/ hard charging....call 'em whatever you like) riders are nothing new. get smart, use your experience to deal with them.

Stoners little speech to the media about Ducati " breaking" the testing rules.......Duck me Frunk !!!....if the shoe was on the other foot ????????????? !!!!!!!!!!!

twat.

These guys, with the exception of Pedrosa in regards to the Motegi thing, are a bunch of babies
when off the bike, and sans helmet.


I absolutley loved Vermuellens approach, when asked at the Island " home GP Chris, you must be dissapointed with 17th ?"


"Oh, it could have been better, but we will work on it and try to improve it for next time, but dissapointed........mate, I'm a bricklayer by trade...and I bet there are thousands of bricklayers who'd love to be doing what I'm doing...I love riding bikes, I get paid to do it...........so, everyday is a good day !"

Regardless of the pointless arguments of who's more talented than who..........I find that to be a good general reflection of most of the personality types you meet anywhere in the whole motorcycling community.

.....The big three are acting like bloody babies...when off the bike.


What would Aunty Jack have to say to Stoner ??? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Shut up and ride.


Just how I see it........not gospel.
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby OZintheDesert on Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:58 am

Seriously.. I think times have changed a little and the expectations on these guys are somewhat heavier than those of yesteryear. Apart from the fact that the bikes a faster, heavier, more highly technical etc... and getting a lap time within .001 of your 10 previous is more of an imperative than simply the .1 or 1.0 of previous eras.

Personally I think we as "arm chair experts" have no right to call any one a "twat" or "pussy" without adequate justification. Have you put your self at risk in this way time in time out for a pay check?

Zaphod wrote:Well, to Quote Donald "duck" Dunn........"If the shit fits, wear it"


Stoners little speech to the media about Ducati " breaking" the testing rules.......Duck me Frunk !!!....if the shoe was on the other foot ????????????? !!!!!!!!!!!

twat.

Care to provide a source for that one?

Sans helmet Pedrosa has been saying as much as anyone with his gestures.

AFAIC, Schwantz can say what ever he likes, his opinion when weighed up against those others in his position would appear to be the dissention. However, and with all due respect, he is a "has been", which is much more qualified than a "never was".
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby Zaphod on Wed Jul 20, 2011 3:16 am

OZintheDesert wrote: Care to provide a source for that one?



Yep..on this forum.........click on the link in the last paragraph.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011/06 ... _the_.html

I read the rules, understood what was said, and found I could not criticise Duck's interpretation..........or, was that JB's interpretaion ?? ;)

good, balanced article by Kropotkin............

so,.....if the shoe was on the other foot, what would he have said.......going on history, I can only guess. Probably the same as Rossi, JB and Duck are saying now.

Maybe if he read, or had someone inform him of the rules, he could have said "technically they can do it, and I don't know why Honda and others don't exploit this loop-hole." he sort of did, but he had an uneducated stab at Duck doing it as well....... sour grapes that they weren't doing it when he was there ?............then again, he ( and Duck) didn't have the experience of JB at his disposal to interperate the rules in that manner back then.........
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Re: Schwantz interview. (MCN scan)

Postby OZintheDesert on Wed Jul 20, 2011 3:39 am

Zaphod wrote:
OZintheDesert wrote: Care to provide a source for that one?



Yep..on this forum.........click on the link in the last paragraph.

http://motomatters.com/analysis/2011/06 ... _the_.html

I read the rules, understood what was said, and found I could not criticise Duck's interpretation..........or, was that JB's interpretaion ?? ;)

good, balanced article by Kropotkin............

so,.....if the shoe was on the other foot, what would he have said.......going on history, I can only guess. Probably the same as Rossi, JB and Duck are saying now.

Maybe if he read, or had someone inform him of the rules, he could have said "technically they can do it, and I don't know why Honda and others don't exploit this loop-hole." he sort of did, but he had an uneducated stab at Duck doing it as well....... sour grapes that they weren't doing it when he was there ?............then again, he ( and Duck) didn't have the experience of JB at his disposal to interperate the rules in that manner back then.........


No where in that article was Stoner's name even mentioned let alone attributed as the proponent of your argument. I asked for a source where Stoner implicitly said what you stated.. So far.. swing and a miss
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