Purses? - Prize Money? - Or Payments?

[jlv916]

For a long time I have wondered what kind of a money structure MotoGP has for riders, teams and manufacturers.

Is there any prize money paid out by Moto GP to the riders or the teams from Dorna, or the individual promoters? If so; what is the structure of the payments?

I know that the top riders receive generous salaries from the teams. What do the teams (and riders) get from Dorna? What do the other non factory, teams and riders have for motivation?

I realize that some of the lesser talented riders have to produce sponsorship money to even get a ride. Is there any way for riders who are not at the top of their sport to get any $ return for their efforts?

I have never heard anything mentioned, or seen anything written, about this part of the great sport of MotoGP. Does Dorna, or someone else, want to keep this subject away from the public (supporters of the races and of the racers) for some reason.

I think a good explanation of the payout money structure, or the lack of same, would make for a very interesting subject to be discussed on these pages.

[RatsMC]

We'll really never have a clear understanding of how all the money flows. Just to give you some idea, until Ezpeleta explained that he would be ending payments to satellite teams, I didn't realize that Dorna was spending 50% of their budget just to keep the satellite teams on the grid.

[Kropotkin]

Money is a very sensitive subject, and nobody will talk much about it. Rider contracts, especially, are sensitive, and very complicated. Some riders will be paid, but only out of the sponsorship they bring. Only a very few are actually paid a living wage, the rest are either unpaid or paid very poorly. One day, I hope to assemble enough information to write something sensible about this subject.

[yzr750]

Money is a very sensitive subject, and nobody will talk much about it. Rider contracts, especially, are sensitive, and very complicated. Some riders will be paid, but only out of the sponsorship they bring. Only a very few are actually paid a living wage, the rest are either unpaid or paid very poorly. One day, I hope to assemble enough information to write something sensible about this subject.

That's a pretty poor situation considering the riders are the ones putting their lives on the line for the show, compare it to nearly any ballsports.
But then again most are probably happy just to be there.

[oldboyonrgv]

dont start me on this topic.......

[jlv916]

I am really (REALLY) amazed at the lack of knowledge in this area of such a widely publicized and popular sport. I am equally amazed that not many of your followers have asked these same (or better) questions about this area of motoGP.

I think that this is a subject that would make for very interesting reading, and result in a lot of input fron the members of this forum. Now that the season is over, and there is a little more time in the day for David to do research, this would make a great feature article and one that a lot of fans would relate to and would give their input on.

From what little I have read so far I must asume that Dorna (and/or the promoters) do not offer any prize money to the riders or teams. Do the factories pay Dorna to participate? Do the satellite teams pay, or receive money (someone said they used to receive money from Dorna - but will not in the furure). One reply to my original post was - "don't start me on this topic" - well that was exactally what I did not want to hear. I wanted to get everyone started on this subject! I think that racing fans deserve to know what ALL riders (and teams) earn (or spend) to be a part of the motoGP grid. Remember that your favorite rider is risking his life to entertain you - They all should be paid accordingly although I understand that they are not!

I just hope a little more (actually a lot more) light shoud be shed on this subject. It seems like such a grey area that needs to be brought out into public view.

The races are very expensive to attend and I wonder where all the money goes. Unless the sanctioning fees are very, very expensive the promoters should be making a killing. Or, Is Dorna actually the promoter, from behind the scenes?

I think this is something that needs to be out in the open so that fans and the general public know what the real situation is. Maybe this is a subject that is to sensitive to tackle....I certainly hope not.

[Kropotkin]

I think that racing fans deserve to know what ALL riders (and teams) earn (or spend) to be a part of the motoGP grid.

Do you go around telling everyone what you earn?

Here's what I know:

The organizers pay Dorna to organize the race. Dorna also gets the TV rights and sponsorship money.
Dorna pays about half of its income to the teams, most of which goes to MotoGP, but Moto2 and 125s get money too. Most of the other half goes on running costs, they have several hundred people at each track, who need to be housed, fed and clothed, and paid salaries. I seem to recall they made about 8 million euros in profit last year, but they are paying off their owners Bridgepoint, who paid nearly half a million to take over Dorna.

Teams raise money from where they can. Well-funded teams can afford to pay the top riders, but I would guess that only the MotoGP riders get paid, a handful (maybe 10) Moto2 riders, and a similar number of 125 (Moto3) riders. Everyone else brings money to be able to race.

Rider salaries:
Rossi: about 15 million
Lorenzo: 8 million
Stoner: 5 million (though we will have made a lot more through win bonuses this year)
Pedrosa: 4 million
Edwards: 250,000
I know that James Ellison was earning 30,000 GBP when he was racing in MotoGP for Tech 3. I expect that Aoyama is earning a little more than that, perhaps twice or three times as much.

Salaries are variable on results, and can be improved vastly if you have a good year. That does not include personal sponsorship either, which can be a lot more.

I believe Dorna pays the teams based on their results, the better you do, the more money you get.

Dorna only pays the satellite teams, but given that most of their budget goes to the factories to pay for leasing the bikes, Dorna is indirectly subsidizing the factories, hence the CRT project.

That's a start.

[Squidpuppet]

I think that racing fans deserve to know what ALL riders (and teams) earn (or spend) to be a part of the motoGP grid.

Why? Salaries and bonuses are typically private matters except for executives of publicly traded companies.

I admit that I'd be very interested in reading about all the behind the scenes money twists, but I can respect their desire for privacy, and I certainly dont deserve to know what anyones paycheck and budget are.

[Rossifumi]

Remember that your favorite rider is risking his life to entertain you - They all should be paid accordingly although I understand that they are not!

The riders are out there because they love racing not out of a sense of duty to entertain the public.

[phil]

Stoner: 5 million (though we will have made a lot more through win bonuses this year)

[Gustav O]

I think it is very hard to trace all the money and how it trickle down through the system.
For example in Moto2 the teams collect tires from Dunlop and the bill is sent to each local Dunlop distributer, in the teams home countries, who has to bill the teams. The result is that a lot of teams have taken out tires that they have not paid to the local Dunlop distribuers who now are chasing them for payments. A team need tires for app. 80-90 000 Euro for a season.

It is extremly expensive in the smaller classes as well.
Suter have a lot of frames from this year that you can buy for next year if you pay a whooping 75 000 Euro, includes spares. CEV is the probable market as they are the only one running Moto2 nationally.
A wild card in Moto2 has to pay 12.500 for the engine lease and they have two hours to return it to Honda after the race.

I think a lot of the teams in Moto2 and 125 are struggling to survive and without the Dorna money they would not survive.

[phoenix1]

I am really (REALLY) amazed at the lack of knowledge in this area of such a widely publicized and popular sport. I am equally amazed that not many of your followers have asked these same (or better) questions about this area of motoGP.

It probably is too sensitive to tackle b/c the commercial rights agreements are valuable intellectual property. Everything is kept under wraps. The F1 Concorde Agreement has been around for over 30 years, but the actual document has leaked only once, in 1997 (IIRC). The Concorde is basically just an agreement between the commercial rights holders and the participants for revenue-sharing, rules, coutries to race in, number of rounds, etc. MotoGP has something similar.

The basic arrangement is probably like F1. The promoter pays MotoGP for a race, then the promoter finds a track. Sometimes the track and the promoter are more-or-less the same entity. Dorna also receive money by selling TV coverage contracts to the TV companies. Dorna provides them with a global feed, and they rebroadcast it with their own commentary in the native language. Dorna receive further funds from sponsorship, MotoGP.com memberships, and from licensing the MotoGP name for video games and other such.

According to an article on Krop's site, MotoGP supposedly generates $250M in revenues and Dorna only make $8M profit. I'm guessing MotoGP works like F1 with a 50/50 revenue split after certain deductions. Again, I'm guessing, but I think the cost of producing the global TV feed is deducted. If F1 spend $120-$150M to make an F1 global feed, I bet Dorna are spending around $80M. So Dorna and IRTA probably split the remaining $160M (to keep the math simple).

The MSMA probably get $10M each plus $2M for each satellite bike they produce (we know they definitely get extra for making satellite bikes, Ezpeleta said so). Satellite IRTA teams probably get $2M per bike. GP costs around $74M for a 17 bike grid of 800cc 21L. The remaining 6 million is divided up for the Moto2 and Moto3 teams. Dorna probably spend $48M on personnel and transportation costs to fly the bikes and officials all over the world. They also pay certain teams to field certain riders and such. Of the remaining $32M, 75% belongs to Bridgepoint, and the other $8M belongs to Dorna (the split info is not totally correct b/c I believe Ezpeleta has a share of the revenue himself).

These numbers mean nothing, and I wouldn't take them to heart other than the $250M in revenues and $8M to Dorna. This is just a math problem of sorts for you to get the gist of how complicated commercial rights agreements divide revenue. In F1, the payoff matrix for the participants is infinitely more complicated than the flat-rate I used for MSMA members. Just FYI.

That's as much as I know. If you learn more, let us know.