2012 Estoril MotoGP Race Result: Winner Controls Race From The Front

Result and summary of the MotoGP race at Estoril:

Casey Stoner has taken victory at the Portuguese Grand Prix at Estoril, controlling the race from the front to win a comfortable victory, despite pressure from Jorge Lorenzo throughout the race. Stoner's win at Estoril is his second in a row, both of which came at circuits he has never won at before. With the victory, Stoner takes the lead in the championship by a single point from Jorge Lorenzo.

Stoner had the race under control almost from the first few corners. Dani Pedrosa got the holeshot, but a twitch on the exit of Turn 1 saw him lose two places, with Stoner taking over the lead, and Lorenzo slotting in behind him. The three immediately started to pull a gap, at first in the company of Ben Spies, but the Texan ran wide into Turn 6, losing two places, and more importantly, losing touch with the leaders.

From that point forward, a typical MotoGP unfolded. Three men, at the limit of their machines and their ability, lapped within a few hundredths of each other all race long. Stoner's lead at first looked safe, but as the race approached two-thirds distance, Lorenzo started closing up. But Lorenzo's efforts would be in vain: the Factory Yamaha man was stronger in the final section, but everything he gained in the last sector Stoner took back in the first half of the track. With a couple of laps to go, Stoner pushed hard to break the opposition, and Lorenzo was forced to let him go. Dani Pedrosa, who had followed the leading pair all race long, came home in 3rd.

Behind the leaders, the fight that will be one of the most fascinating this season opened another chapter at Estoril. Monster Tech 3 Yamaha teammates Andrea Dovizioso and Cal Crutchlow fought over 4th place, with nothing to choose between them. Crutchlow led for the first few laps, but Dovizioso came past in the first corner on lap 5, and the Italian pushed to try to drop his teammate. Crutchlow was not inclined to go along with Dovizioso's plan, and hounded his teammate for most of the race. He got close enough to try to pass at one point, but ran wide at Turn 6 and lost touch. In the end, he could do nothing about Dovizioso, losing out to his Italian teammate for the first time this year.

Alvaro Bautista rode a lonely but strong race to come home in 6th, while behind him Valentino Rossi shook off early challenges by Stefan Bradl to come home in 7th on the factory Ducati. After his eventful early laps, Ben Spies made up ground to finish in 8th - better than Qatar and Jerez, but still nowhere near where he should be - passing Stefan Bradl late in the race and demoting the German to 9th. Hector Barbera rounded out the top 10, putting his Pramac Ducati ahead of the second Factory Ducati of Nicky Hayden, who finished 11th. Aleix Espargaro won the battle of the Aspars, holding off Randy de Puniet to be the first CRT bike.

Stoner's victory means that the Australian has now won at every track on the MotoGP calendar. The Repsol Honda man had just Jerez and Estoril missing from his list of wins at the start of the season, and now he has those to crossed off the list as well. Stoner now leads the championship by just 1 point, 66 points to Lorenzo's 65, and the title chase is turning into a two-horse race between the 2010 and 2011 World Champion.

Results:

Pos. No. Rider Manufacturer Time Diff
1 1 Casey STONER HONDA 45'37.513  
2 99 Jorge LORENZO YAMAHA 45'38.934 1.421
3 26 Dani PEDROSA HONDA 45'41.134 3.621
4 4 Andrea DOVIZIOSO YAMAHA 45'51.359 13.846
5 35 Cal CRUTCHLOW YAMAHA 45'54.203 16.690
6 19 Alvaro BAUTISTA HONDA 45'59.397 21.884
7 46 Valentino ROSSI DUCATI 46'04.310 26.797
8 11 Ben SPIES YAMAHA 46'10.775 33.262
9 6 Stefan BRADL HONDA 46'13.380 35.867
10 8 Hector BARBERA DUCATI 46'30.876 53.363
11 69 Nicky HAYDEN DUCATI 46'40.143 1'02.630
12 41 Aleix ESPARGARO ART 46'58.249 1'20.736
13 14 Randy DE PUNIET ART 47'00.996 1'23.483
14 51 Michele PIRRO FTR 47'15.418 1'37.905
15 9 Danilo PETRUCCI IODA 46'01.358 1 lap
Not Classified
  17 Karel ABRAHAM DUCATI 39'52.674 5 laps
  77 James ELLISON ART 30'51.198 10 laps
  68 Yonny HERNANDEZ BQR 26'59.749 12 laps
  54 Mattia PASINI ART 18'33.107 17 laps
  22 Ivan SILVA BQR 19'10.392 17 laps

 

Race Details
2012
Result and summary of the MotoGP race at Estoril:

Comments

Could some explain what the different "mappings" are?

Here's a question for those in the know. Listening to the post race interviews both Casey and Dani mentioned how they tried different "mappings" throughout the race to find something that worked. What exactly does this mean? I'm assuming they've got a few different electronics parameters programed into the bike and at the touch of a button can switch from one to another, but I'm really just guessing. Can anyone enlighten me on the what they are referring to when they talk about trying different mappings? p.s. Congrats Casey. Another amazing performance. Same goes for Jorge and Dani. Flawless riding all round.

Total votes: 30

to my understanding it means

to my understanding it means the ECI has predefined values to the amount of gas being injected into the engine when you have a given airbox pressure X, air temperature Y and throttle position Z. one set of values (input parameters -> amount of gas being injected) is called a mapping.
Now you can have different amount of gas being injected for the same set of input parameters, they result in different throttle behavior and are stored in different mappings.
The rider can switch between mappings with buttons on the handlebar.

the bottom line of the significance of mappings is how the engine reacts to twists of the right hand.
this change of engine behaviour is meaningless on accelerating on a straight line (where wheely control does it all) but very important at corner apex at maximum lean angle where just a fraction to much drive will highside you.

Total votes: 25

aaahh

Thanks for the insight MC

Total votes: 22

Mapping

I would imagine the mapping would not only alter the fuel mixture, but also the ignition timing.
Retarding the timing would decrease engine hp and torque, which would soften the engine performance.

Total votes: 23

Graet Ride

Great Ride by Stoner he had a few problems through out race which allowed Lorenzo to catch up but changed his riding style and produced the goods to keep Lorenzo in second place. It eas awesome to watch Casey slide Honda around the corners of Estoril.

Total votes: 35

Picky

From last week Stoner was already the only rider in the paddock having won on every single track actually on the calendar.

Today he became the only rider to win MotoGP races on every track.

The difference is Estoril 250GP win in 2005 ;-)

Total votes: 54

What is it with the stars?

Frenchie provides a bit of accurate information and people are giving it low ratings? WTF? Is motomatters now also invaded by the spotty 13yo mindset of clicking "you suck" on anything positive about a rider one doesn't fancy?

Total votes: 50

Good point

Good point, Graham. The star rating is something that has done for a number of other websites with forums. You can't really expect the site owner to moderate every single post. Readers who value this website need to be able to police the site themselves and really the only way to do that at present is to restrain oneself from knee-jerk partisan evaluations of posts that present not opinion, but objectively verifiable facts.

Total votes: 41

Sometimes accepting a mistake

Sometimes accepting a mistake and saying i am sorry, also receives a lot of negative votes.. LOL. Does it really matter either way? The blog is a just a medium of communication, and if someone does not like your opinion or comment, YOU should not care about it. And if you DO, then you think twice before you type it in public.

Total votes: 36

1 star for you

:D

I also think we have a couple of people who troll around. On some of the low-comment threads, which don't receive much voting, I've seen strings of posts with 1 star ratings.

Total votes: 28

Like watching paint dry. Time

Like watching paint dry. Time was you had a good race cause you made progress. These days in what is a pityful field(no offence CRT) holding your position appears to be a world class performance. Is Jorge not even showing casey a wheel on a factory yam really a brilliant ride. Nope. Great ride by casey the rest just followed home. Rossi half a minute in front of the other dukes. Pats on the backs all round in the shed afterwards except presiozi who looked very much like he'd been ignored. if dorna have any chance to salvage this year they could do worse than swapping Rossi and spies. Good race from Cal as well.

Total votes: 50

You actually think Lorenzo

You actually think Lorenzo was able to overtake Stoner? He was no where near close enough.

I think the whining has become more tiring than the racing itself.

Total votes: 42

Pats on the back in the

Pats on the back in the Ducati camp for finishing almost 27 seconds behind the leader? That's 27 seconds behind a Honda with severe chatter problems. Finishing 7th is neither here nor there, it's the gap to the leaders that matters. In 2011 Rossi finished fifth, just over 16 seconds behind the leaders, so Ducati have gone backwards big time. Right now neither Rossi or Spies are doing anything to justify a top works ride.

Total votes: 34

Predictable

The comments on here are as predictable as the racing.

If you are a Stoner fan then it was a master class of consistent lapping, throttle control and managing the gap to your closer rival

If you are a Rossi fan, then it was an improvement and a return to being top Ducati, but nothing else.

If you are a Spies fan, it was another headscratcher - how can a rider be so far off the front on one of the four bikes that are actually capable of winning the race?

If you are a neutral/new to motorcycle racing, then it was 40 minutes of watching bikes ride around a tight and twisty track with less than one overtake a minute and no overtakes after the second corner for the front three. Not something that will attract casual viewers or new sponsorship - which the sport will need to survive.

MotoGP (and this place of late) is becoming more tribal than football. If your preferred rider wins then it's a "great race" and a "masterclass". Otherwise...

Total votes: 47

not exactly

"Ducati have gone backwards big time"

"Right now Rossi [isn't doing] anything to justify a top works ride."

Seems to me those statements contradict each other. Anyway, the statements by Pedrosa and Stoner that they have no interest in riding the Ducati would seem to back up the idea that the bike is a career dead end as opposed to anything resembling "a top works ride".

Total votes: 37

Someone was suggesting that

Someone was suggesting that Rossi replace Spies on the Yamaha, one of the top works rides (along with Honda). Seeing that Ducati with Rossi have gone backwards, Rossi is doing nothing to deserve a top works ride at Yamaha. Nothing contradictory about that at all.

Total votes: 48

Fuel mapping

David, This race look very similiar to last week---Casey out front, Jorge catching him toward the end, then Casey speeding up the last few laps to win w/ease. Do you have any info about the fuel mapping? Is Casey's electronics turning down the fuel to make sure he has enough to finish the race and then when he 'brain' knows there's enough in the tank, adds some? I have difficulty believing that Casey gets slower in the middle part of the race and then speeds up, unless he's just playing w/the field.

Total votes: 31

Mappings and Chatter

Both Stoner and Pedrosa said they were struggling with chatter, which was worse in the middle of the race. That was why the slowed a little, trying to select a mapping (basically a set of fueling and traction control parameters) that changed the behavior of the bike to stop it from happening. The rear was chattering, which upsets the traction control, as the bike is gripping and then not gripping as it bounces. Chatter got better towards the end, so Stoner pushed on to get a bigger gap.

Total votes: 33

The chatter was terrible

Even on my tiny decidedly low definition T.V I could clearly see the very significant chatter Stoner was experiencing on the couple of slow-mo's. Yamaha and Lorenzo are going to have to find some answers because they won't see Stoner for dust if and when HRC get this sorted.

Total votes: 37

Chicken or egg?

Does the chatter upset the TC, or does TC cause the chatter? Chatter at the rear in general, and chatter you can modify with TC settings, doesn't sound like a chassis problem, it sounds like a TC disfunction.

Total votes: 22

I saw the chatter, too, and I

I saw the chatter, too, and I think that is why Stoner stopped sliding the bike over one of the painted sections - because at first it would slide there when on the gas, but later in the race it was chattering quite badly. So he was looking for a map that allowed him to slide (his preferred style) through those corner rather than having to be off the gas and then back on, which would slow him down.
Think of chatter as axle tramp like we used to see in old muscle cars - the rear end tries to apply power and the forces try to make the rear end squat. When this happens the shock damping tries to slow the rate of squat (compression) and of course the spring is acting to try to return the bike to normal ride height. To stop it returning too quickly the rebound damping tries to slow the rate of rise of the shock.
The level of traction available from the tyre also influences this scenario.
What you end up with when the rear end geometry/damping is not right are these forces working in direct conflict, which introduces oscillations into the wheel movement. When the wheel is oscillating up and down this reduces traction and the bike feels like it is shaking itself to bits.
The oscillations in a well set-up bike are relatively far apart, like a low frequency wave. Chatter is when the oscillations are too close together.
It can happen at both the front and rear.

Total votes: 26

From a technical point of

From a technical point of view, chatter is not at the rear, it starts at the front and due to energy transfer moves to the rear instantaneously. So TC might have a big effect on the normal chatter which roots from the front wheel. But a bounce weave coupling, also called rear end chatter might have something to do with TC since it occurs in the accelerating phase. Now, the front end chatter and rear end chatter can only be solved with a better chassis, i.e. frame and swingarm. A portion of the rear end chatter can be controlled by the TC, but not a whole lot.

Total votes: 27

That sounded impressive

but I couldn't make sense of any of it, sorry. Energy transfer? Why would it move to the rear "instantaneously"? How would TC have an effect on "normal chatter which roots from the front"?

Total votes: 21

Yes sir, Think of the

Yes sir, Think of the motorcycle as a single bar with two supports. a force applied at one end of the bar with support will produce moments and corresponding reaction forces on the other support automatically. There will be change in potential energy of the bar at various instants of time from the time at which the force was applied (transient system). There will also be a change in the energy across the length of the bar due to the force applied. The technique itself is called energy methods.

And why would it move? hmm, think of fixing the bar close to one end and apply a force . Try to count with an atomic clock how fast the energy transferred from one portion to the other.

and TC WILL NOT have any effect on normal chatter. I am sorry, it was a typo.. i forgot to put NOT. :D

Total votes: 27

Spies

With both Tech 3s finishing ahead of him, Spies certainly didn't do anything to erase the now rather large question mark hanging over his Yamaha factory future. He's looking more 'Edwards-ish' all the time, albeit he did win a race last year (almost 2), which is something Edwards never managed to do.

He needs a big turnaround; will be interesting to see if he can pull it off.

Total votes: 26

Yawn...... There was some

Yawn......

There was some hope for excitement via Crutchlow. But after he ran off the track, his chances to attack(and entertain) went as well.

Crutchlow is quickly be coming a fan favorite rider, so when he's too far back or unable to attack, you'll need to grab some smelling salts. None of the other riders are willing to take chances and go for it.

Post race Lorenzo stated: "in the chicane, I wanted to make a move(on Casey) but it was too risky". Oh well, we certainly can't have risk.

I'm not a NASCAR fan, but you can certainly see the appeal(compared to MotoGP and Formula 1) and appreciate the NASCAR "2nd place is 1st loser" racing style. Taking risks, bumping, intimidating and never apologizing is common practice.....

So can Cruthlow pick up where Simoncelli left off and thrill the audience........(and the way it's looking) save the series? Sure hope so. The cameras might as well stay on Crutchlow the whole race, he's probably the only one that will do something exciting and interesting.

Keep coming #35....factory M1 next season.

Total votes: 42

Cruthlow

Cruthlow did overtake Dovi once or twice so far this season which is not a bad effort, but that's it. He could not do it today and the most 'exiting and interesting' thing he did was to go off track. So much for 'saving the series'. I do recall Stoner going from 9th to 1st in Jerez last week, which wasn't bad either, let say a bit more exciting, because he did overtake almost all work bikes in,let say two laps :).

Total votes: 33

None of the other riders are

None of the other riders are willing to take chances and go for it.

Post race Lorenzo stated: "in the chicane, I wanted to make a move(on Casey) but it was too risky". Oh well, we certainly can't have risk.

Never raced, have you Vlad ?

Those fella's are on the absolute limit and beyond, and you want George to try and dive in from so far back and take CS and himself out with something that can never come off ?

Were you actually watching the same race I was ?
Did you see any of the slo-mo's ?
George was just hanging with CS, he was in no position to pull a move at any stage.

If you want close racing and lots of overtaking watch a Red Bull Rookies race, or Formula Ford in cars, or better still dirt track racing, cars or bikes.

If you want contrivance, watch NASCAR.

If you want to see the absolute best riders control the absolute wildest bikes on a bitumen track, you watch Moto GP. (and marvel)

Total votes: 52

" Never raced, have you Vlad ? "

+ 1. Good question ( two thumbs up !! )

And the answer is the reason there is so much horse puckey written here.

Total votes: 21

Weird post

You reference NASCAR, a sport that uses a giant cage to protect the demolition derby participant. Then you hope that a new rider will take up the entertainment mantle, by using the same never-say-die tactics that ultimately led to Simoncelli's death.

I like ballsy sport, but this isn't ancient Rome, and I don't feel entertained when people die on live TV for no particular reason. Simoncelli wasn't even 'entertaining' people with his passing skills when it happened. He simply fell off and refused to let go.

Personally, I feel that two deaths in two seasons is an indicator that the status quo should be challenged. The GPC continue adding horsepower and weight, which is a marketing strategy used by every 4-wheel series on earth. Motorcycle racers aren't protected by crash boxes, and I wonder if Burgess isn't right to say that smaller power and lighter bikes is a better direction. The lap times would be roughly the same, the top speeds would be similar, but the energy in a rider strike would be a lot less. Marketing, not sport, pushes MotoGP in a different direction.

Total votes: 38

Ducati Spin Doctor

No, no pun intended. Amazing, how the corporate spin doctors of MotoGP, Ducati and probably PMI made us actually believe that is Rossi finally getting to terms with the Ducati. Yes, it looked like he was more comfortable in the bike - or did I just see what I was being told.

Compare to last year at Estoril - also 3rd race and in dry conditions: almost half the distance to the winner, only 7-8 seconds behind Stoner and battling to the end with a Repsol Honda. Last year, Rossi was .68 off on the fastest race lap, today 1.2 off. And as for Hayden, he went even further backwards losing an additional 6 seconds compared to last year, which was dismal already.

How Ducati can get away with labeling this performance mildly successful is just an indication of the low level of expectation they are at.

Wonder if Moody's observation of Rossi at the press meeting tells a story of a rider being forced to hold back his genuine view of the current situation.

Total votes: 33

Jeremy Burgess

BBC interviewed Jeremy at the end of the GP asking whether the 7th place was a good sign for Ducati and Valentino. His answer was quite simply 'no'. He thought that the slightly better result was mainly due to the characteristics of the track. His expression and body language were not promising, possibly confirming that the situation in the Rossi side of the Ducati paddock is indeed quite tense. Here a decent post with some considerations about this matter:

http://manziana.motocorse.com/blog/32304_Consistencies_My_way_ENG.php

Total votes: 27

Perhaps it's time for Corse

to poach the electronic technicians that HRC poached from YMC.

Total votes: 27

Correct

I completely agree with you. After almost every race since Rossi first rode the Ducati, he says something like this - "We are not where we want to be, but the bike definitely feels better than the last race, and we expect the new parts we will get at the next race will make things a bit better".

Continuously stating that 5th or 6th or 7th place is not where they want to be but things are getting better . . . . They are not getting better, they are maintaining the status quo. Maybe keeping up with the developments of Honda and Yamaha is called "getting better" - to Rossi and Ducati but not to me. I put this comment to Tony Moody. I wish someone would press Rossi about this.

Total votes: 25

New engine

Don't forget Ducati are testing a new engine. Perhaps they anticipate major improvements by using an engine that has been designed for an aluminum twin spar.

Total votes: 28

I'm a little confuse about

I'm a little confuse about the new engine, there are a lot of different versions going around about it. As far as I can gather the new engine won't be ready until a third or half way through the championship and tomorrow there will be updates to the one they have. Then there are some who say tomorrow there are both electronic and mechanical updates and those who say there are only electronic updates. I really hope Ducati doesn't leave the test without telling what they tested.

Total votes: 24

Gotta wonder

what it will be like once HRC sorts it chatter and Stoner races at full fitness.

Total votes: 31

Yeah, it was a dull race.

That happens every so often. And this was the first dull one this year. Are we so spoiled that we have to gripe loudly when it happens?

Total votes: 27

The " gripers " represent .....

those who who are too stupid to appreciate the skill levels of those at the sharp end and the pressure they are under.

Watching Lorenzo hunting down Stoner is not exactly boring, nail biting , yes, but not f*****g boring !!!

Total votes: 40

Boring is a personal

Boring is a personal appreciation, something that bores me might excite you. that makes my assertion of it being boring just as correct as yours of it being exiting. Making us both right and certainly neither one of us would be smarter or stupider that the other.
Something that might be worthier of discussion would be the difference between "hunting down" and "following"

Total votes: 32

lorenzo

today lorenzo had everything to win and he did not. He even did the best lap of the race which proves that the yamaha m1 was up there pace wise. Everyone keep banging on about how lorenzo is better than rossi but not a single pass on stoner while having the best race pace?? Rossi said lorenzo learnt a lot from him and the fact that lorenzo wants him back at yamaha means he still has a lot more to learnt from rossi.

Total votes: 29

I don't know if you were

I don't know if you were watching the same race I was but George couldn't get close enough to pull a move.

Total votes: 40

Not likely

"Rossi said lorenzo learnt a lot from him and the fact that lorenzo wants him back at yamaha means he still has a lot more to learnt from rossi."

It is doubtful that Jorge 'wants' Rossi back as you assert as Jorge was doing no more than being polite and playing the game when he was asked the question that Rossi has paraphrased.

There is little that Lorenzo can learn from Rossi today and dare it be suggested that Rossi learnt as much from Lorenzo as Lorenzo did from Rossi when they were team mates anyhow.

Total votes: 24

I disagree. I think Lorenzo

I disagree. I think Lorenzo could still learn some from Rossi. All greats never stop learning. At worst, he could help him with development with the M1 because the way it stands now, that Yamaha/Lorenzo combination has not and will not have an answer for Casey. A challenge for Stoner would certainly be welcomed.

Total votes: 24

Rossi is not an engineer...

I thought for sure that the Rossi debacle would have settled this - but, one more time, riders do not lead development. The role of the rider in improving the bike is entirely limited to the rider's ability to communicate how the bike is behaving to their crew chief, who decides whether using the adjustable parameters of the bike can solve the problem. If yes - happy rider. If no, the crew chief can request that the factory redevelops a targeted area of the bike to see if they can improve performance.

In addition to this, the factory never stops developing the bike on their side of the fence, using test riders to evaluate any changes. If they deem the change to be positive, the part(s) are then passed on to the factory team to further evaluate. That side of the work is done with no rider/team involvement at all until the parts are handed over.

Agree entirely on the rider learning curve never ending.

I think the only thing that can help Lorenzo at the moment is more power, but that comes with its own set of negatives.

Total votes: 25

Risk and Reward

Whilst I agree that the race was perhaps not the most interesting, I believe it can be explained by a number of conditions which forced the race to unfold the way it did. The first part of the equation is that Stoner is fast, accurate and relentless, so when Stoner gets to P1 you'll see him do everything he can to stay there and rightly so, nobody can blame him for that.

Then there's Lorenzo who has to think very, very carefully. Given the consistency, speed and overall competitiveness of Stoner, Lorenzo knows full well that any slight slip, any mistake or any open door will see him sacrifice points to his direct opposition. Last year saw Lorenzo make a mistake at Phillip Island which cost him the mathematical possibility to win the championship and he absolutely cannot afford to do that again and so he's forced to play the safe game, which I'm sure he doesn't really want to do but that's the situation. This situation is further compounded by...

Dani Pedrosa. With Pedrosa threateningly close to Lorenzo during the whole race, a 0.5s mistake by Lorenzo would see an eager Repsol-coloured blur take another four points from him and put him 5 points aside of two Hondas in the championship and that's where wins really start to count.

I'm not saying Lorenzo did the right thing by doing what I perceive as him playing safe but I can certainly understand the reasons for it and that is why I don't believe this race could've happened any other way.

Total votes: 32

Daunting

It must be tough for Lorenzo having Stoner win the last 2 races at tracks that have never been his strength. These would have been races that Lorenzo would have been expecting to get a points lead over Stoner (like last year) . There will be some head scratching in the Yamaha camp.

Total votes: 23

Maybe not that daunting

Whether or not Lorenzo is pragmatically viewing these defeats as pawn sacrifices is the question. By all fair measures, Lorenzo should've won at Jerez and Estoril but equally Stoner should've won at Qatar. We're three races into the season and the race results have been the inverse of what I would've bet on.

Total votes: 21

Why should Lorenzo have won

Why should Lorenzo have won at Jerez and Estoril? This is Stoner on a Honda, not Stoner on a Ducati. I agree that they are two tracks that the Yamaha should be relatively stronger on, but lets not forget that Pedrosa is also normally stronger at these two tracks. Pedrosa had one of his best wins at Estoril last year. The fact that Stoner has won on these two tracks despite arm pump and chatter tells us all we need to know about how the rest of the season is likely to pan out, provided he is not adversely affected by the arm pump that was the only reason he didn't win in Qatar.

Total votes: 26

That's true

Absolutely, I don't disagree. The point I was trying to make, if a little loosely, was that if I'd lined up bets in the pre-season based on historical performance, I would've pegged Lorenzo for Jerez and Estoril. That's all.

Total votes: 18

Ah yes, the merry-go-round of

Ah yes, the merry-go-round of hard to satisfy MotoGP viewers. So far the racing has been close, certainly we are not seeing Stoner checking out and winning by a huge margin as was the case in 800's many times. I think so far it's an improvement. Still not in the same class as Moto2 racing, so for me, the idea of moving MotoGP to the same rules, I like the idea of.

And the finish in the Moto3 race was totally wild! There was your shout out loud moment. Love watching these little jewels with their cheese-cutter tyres!

Total votes: 29

WIN ON ALL TRACKS IN MOTOGP

Well , as was implied in a post above that Stoner was the only MOTOGP rider to win on all the MOTOGP tracks, then that makes me wonder just what track has Rossi never won on?????? Call me lazy for asking and not researching, but just what track(s) did rossi not win on? Indy? Laguna? or?

It's a personal problem I suppose, but I wish people would not include MOTO2 or MOTO125 or you name it, when talking about wins in MOTOGP. When I hear the name MOTOGP I always think of the upper class NOT some subclass of MOTGP. A win on 125's is NOT equiv to a win on a 500, 800 or liter machine and don't pretend it is, please.

If you include the 125's and 250's or MOTO2 etc, then you might as well include every trail bike win someone has won imho. Yes, I'm a snob in that way. Skill sets are NOT the same.

Bautista is making the Hondas look bad. Go away Bautista. Bradl? I give him a pass since it's his rookie year, but he ain't no Lorenzo or Stoner in comparison to their first years. Spies? I've just now given up on him. Such great promise going into the toilet. It's a crying shame. Maybe a change in crew chiefs? Won't happen but maybe should.

My great claim to fame on the internet? Getting kicked off crashnet for implying Crutchlow might be a Aussie immigrant to Brit isles. Way to go crashnet.

Total votes: 25

Indianapolis

I'll take 'Circuits Rossi has never won at' for 400 please, Alex.

Total votes: 29

Rossi won...

...the "Hurricane" race at Indy.

And Mr. Trebek would never allow a category name that ended with a preposition. (Sorry. Damned pedantic streak...) :-)

Total votes: 26

Prepositions

"This is the sort of bloody nonsense up with which I will not put." - Winston Churchill ;-)

Total votes: 16

Rossi tracks

Rossi hasn't won at Silverstone or Aragon.
He and Stoner have also both won at other tracks that are no longer part of the championship.

Total votes: 26

Aragon

He hasn't won there.
OTOH, how many tracks have he won which are not on the calendar anymore?

Total votes: 25

Tracks no longer on the

Tracks no longer on the calendar where Rossi has won: Rio, Welkom, Suzuka, Shanghai, Donington. That's all I can remember. I don't think Rossi ever won in Turkey.

Total votes: 22

All of them

As far as tracks no longer on the calendar, both Rossi and Stoner have won at all of them. Therefore Stoner is ahead as far as the recordbooks are concerned - having won on every track that MotoGP has ever visited (i.e. since the start of the 2003 season).

Total votes: 24

Wrong

Rio, Welkom and Suzuka were on the calendar after 2003....

Total votes: 19

If both privateer Honda's are so far back

I'm guessing that it's the bike that's the problem and not the riders.

Total votes: 22

Claim to...

People can get kicked off Crashnet? Well, suppose that explains a few questions I've had about commentary content here in the last year or two :)

Total votes: 20

lorenzo 2

oh come on at one point he was only 0.1 behind stoner and he himself admitted he should have tried a pass at the chicane then decided against it. Jerez and estoril are normally lorenzo territory i know he won at qatar where stoner is very strong but thats 2 to 1 now and le mans is another place where i don't see him getting close "enough" as the honda is very strong there.

Total votes: 25

Tyres?

Hi David,

do you have any info on what front tyres the motogp riders used? I gather that they each had access to two of the new type 21.

Did anyone race on them?

I am pretty sure that everyone testing monday will be trying to get a base line on the new tyre given it will be the only one available going forward.

Total votes: 19

opps

sry guys ...must have arm pump entered that twice.

Total votes: 25

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